Those that do argue with others that say they do also! This helped me penetrate through a lot of the cloudiness in nietzsche. While there are plenty of stylistic parallels between Zarathustra and certain religious texts, Common's reads too biblically (intentionally so too, he used the King James Bible as a reference). For each quote, you can also see the other characters and themes related to it (each theme is indicated by its own dot and icon, like this one: ). Beyond Good and Evil. I actually prefer his translation of TSZ to a lot of the more modern ones. Press J to jump to the feed. So, after a vote held, it was decided that r/philosophybookclub will be reading Thus Spoke Zarathustra this Fall! If you're looking for help with a personal book recommendation, consult our Weekly Recommendation Thread, Suggested Reading page, or ask in r/suggestmeabook. ... “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Composed in four parts between 1883 and 1885, Thus Spoke Zarathustra is the most famous and influential work of German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche. of thus spoke zarathustra - this was the deepest nietzsche learning I have done. Reading two translations is going to give you a better sense of the text than any one will. Also sprach Zarathustra, Op. 30 (German: [ˈalzo ʃpʁaːx t͡saʁaˈtʊstʁa] (), Thus Spoke Zarathustra or Thus Spake Zarathustra) is a tone poem by Richard Strauss, composed in 1896 and inspired by Friedrich Nietzsche's philosophical 1883-1885 novel Thus Spoke Zarathustra. It depends heavily on which translation you’re using. Finally, companion books. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work: Failing the above, Twilight of the Idols is a fairly short compression of much of Nietzsche's thought, and I'd highly recommend giving it a go before trying TSZ. I have the Adrian del Caro translation as well, and I end up referencing both fairly often. I own the Martin one and it seems accurate stylistically, but I'm not so sure about content-wise. The first discussion post will go up Monday, Septermber 5th, and another post will appear every Monday (until we finish). I second reading multiple translations, as well as avoiding Common's. I feel he also fails to convey the meaning of much of the German. I'm not sure about Martin though because it's a Barnes & Noble Classics edition, and they generally tend to use horrible translations for them. Thus Spoke Zarathustra is a foundational work of Western literature and is widely considered to be Friedrich Nietzsche’s masterpiece. 2005, page xxxiii. But that won't work with TSZ. Thus Spoke Zarathustra. But if later or earlier philosophers explore the concept in a better way, please enlighten me. In 1896, Alexander Tille made the first English translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra, rendering Übermensch as "Beyond-Man". Well Kaufmann's is the academic standard, for better or worse. Thus Spoke Zarathustra ... “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. Whoever reads his post-humously published writings for the years 1869-82 with care, will constantly meet with passages suggestive of Zarathustra’s thoughts and doctrines. In English. I'm looking for a good translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra for self-guided learning, something with extensive explanations and footnotes, or perhaps a separate companion book. How's your Kant, Schopenhauer, and Hegel? I had also got a fair bit (for a n00b) of psychoanalysis readings under my belt as well. Thus spoke Zarathustra also contains the famous dictum “God is dead“. The composer conducted its first performance on 27 November 1896 in Frankfurt Hi Reddit. But you will still be inspired or shocked or something, because the writing itself is passionate and powerful. He understands Nietzsche very well and is ingenious at coming up with ways of translating Nietzsche's jokes, plays on words, rhymes, and meaning into English in sometimes uncanny ways. If you're able, get different translations from your library and do a quick comparison. "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" is a 19th century literary masterpiece and key philosophical work by Nietzsche. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Best is to read Amazon reviews - keep your salt shaker nearby - along with critical reviews. Kaufmann's abilities as a poetic translator really come to the fore. Another major help is having some understanding of Jung's theories. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Nietzsche was influenced by Arthur Schopenhauer’s The World as Will and Representation (1818), reacting against the pessimism of this book in Thus Spoke Zarathustra.He also draws on ideas from Charles Darwin’s On the Origin of Species (1859) in his musings about human origins and ongoing evolution. When I wanted to buy this book, I spoke to several philosophy teachers at my college that were knowledgeable about Nietzsche and they said that the Kaufmann translation is the best. Jung actually did a huge ass seminar on thus spoke zarathustra that I would love to check it out and is probably really cool. Also, the Kaufmann translation is available in many different bindings so you have variety on your side too. Yeah I kind of figured that. The Birth of Tragedy. I read a bit of the primary text then perused all my commentary books. I'd say they're both pretty much on par in terms of style and content, although if forced to choose I'd opt for the Kaufmann. Again, most people who have read the text did so with the Kaufmann translation. As thought-provoking as ever, “Thus Spoke Zarathustra” remains as one of the most unique philosophical works ever written. Through reading the commentaries I found the best books, and chucked the ones I didnt like/weren't helpful. I have a budding interest in philosophy, but I'm on the easily distractable side and god, is it boring me. Does anyone here own the Martin translation? While there are plenty of stylistic parallels between Zarathustra and certain religious texts, Common's reads too biblically (intentionally so too, he used the King James Bible as a reference). Sometimes readability is what matters. “This is absolutely THE best teacher resource I have ever purchased. The Thus Spoke Zarathustra quotes below all refer to the symbol of Sun, Noon, Noontide. Thus spoke Zarathustra is the classic full-text work by Friedrich Nietzsche. I self learned the first section/book? Thus Spoke Zarathustra Term Analysis | LitCharts. The book is considered among his most well-known and important works. I would avoid Common's translation though. It includes the German philosopher’s famous discussion of the phrase ‘God is dead’ as well as his concept of the Superman. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None First Part Zarathustra’s Prologue The Speeches of Zarathustra On the Three Metamorphoses On the Teachers of Virtue On the Hinterworldly On the Despisers of the Body On the Passions of Pleasure and Pain On the Pale Criminal On Reading and Writing This is a moderated subreddit. Studying eastern & western religions, mysticism, theology, and psychoanalysis...requires much less mental gymnastics to arrive at a similar cloudy point as nietzsche, schopenauer and the like may lead you to if you are mentally fit enough to make it there. As with any Nietzsche text, the text itself is intended to be interpreted and is intentionally impossible to parse and understand via rational inquiries and objectivity. LitCharts assigns a color and icon to each theme in Thus Spoke Zarathustra, which you can use to track the themes throughout the work. I'm only drawn to Nietzsche because of the "God is Dead" concept, ie. Here are the major ones (with their translation of Übermensch listed next to them): I doubt anyone on here has read all of them, but which is supposed to be the best? Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. This edition is printed on premium acid-free paper, is translated by Thomas Common, includes introductions by Willard Huntington Wright and Elizabeth Forster-Nietzsche, and notes by Anthony M. Ludovici. My interest is personal rather than academic. It feels plotless, preachy and bloated with unnecessary metaphor. I think osho may be a nice alternative to reading nietzsche. It is very easy to understand and the cadence of his speech is perfect and evocative for total comprehension. I personally favor Kaufmans translations. There are many books with several different translations, and the only place I've ever really found any information has been searching through Amazon reviews. I'd advise you to instead read something about philosophy of culture where it is pretty much guaranteed Nietzsche will be treated. Parkes' translation was the most enjoyable to read IMHO. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work:. I think I may have had 4 or 5 commentaries. The Cambridge UP text (del Caro's translation) is just a hideously bound edition. I can't claim to have a good handle on what nietzsche is saying - but who really can? Would I be better served by Kierkegaard? Much of the work deals with ideas such as the "eternal recurrence of the same," the parable on the "death of God," and the "prophecy" of the Übermensch, which were first introduced in The Gay Science. The book is a dense and esoteric treatise on philosophy and philosophy, featuring as a fictionalized prophet descending from his recluse to mankind, Zarathustra. the loss of purpose and moral direction in society due to the lessened relevance of religion to modern everyday life. It seems to read VERY much like the Bible. ... Line-by-line modern translations of every Shakespeare play and poem. A bit off-topic, but is there a resource for translation questions like this? Genealogy of Morals. You do. I find nietzsche quite difficult to understand for a number of reasons, one is that he makes many obscure references. I have covered this in a philosophy of culture class and I didn't like it all in the sense that I would use the words of Descartes when he criticized branches of philosophy as building sandcastles. Cookies help us deliver our Services. I first came across Kaufmann for his translation of von Goethe's Faust, and was blown away. Only problem is you walk away with the wrong ideas in your head --ideas that Nietzsche was not promoting. I did have some minimal nietzsche under my belt, but it was really really superficial. While I still find his philosphy very interesting, I have learned much more that answered my questions in non-academic/western philosophy. This abridged version, however, concludes after the climax of the book, The Seven Seals, and does not continue into the fourth and final part of Nietzsche's most iconic work. This is my concern with Nietzsche, he makes a lot of criticisms of non-famous people long dead that aren't going to be understood by the average reader. I've heard that the Martin version isn't too shabby, and I do like the fact that he leaves Übermensch untranslated, so if I were you I'd go with either the Kaufmann or the Hollingdale translations and just read them alongside Martin's. Thus Spoke Zarathustra (hereafter TSZ) is a difficult book to translate. Much of the work deals with ideas such as the "eternal recurrence of the same," the parable on the "death of God," and the "prophecy" of the Übermensch, which were first introduced in The Gay Science. However, I was able to get a much more comprehensive understanding of what he was saying in zarathustra by the following method: I had the kaufmann translation + I went to the library and got more commentaries than I needed that do a play by play of the book. In any case, the translation(s) will be different. If you've read Hegel but no Schopenhauer and have at least a Stanford Encyclopedia article of background in Nietzsche do you think that you can understand Thus Spoke Zarathustra?Currently I'm going through a reading list in chronological order and Thus Spoke Zarathustra is right after Phenomenology of Spirit, Capital, and On Liberty which are going to be all I have post-Kant before … Open menu. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None (German: Also sprach Zarathustra: Ein Buch für Alle und Keinen, also translated as Thus Spake Zarathustra) is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. Parkes' translation was the most enjoyable to read IMHO; wish it had been out when I was a student. Thus Spoke Zarathustra (A Modernized Translation with a New Introduction and Biography) - Kindle edition by Nietzsche, Friedrich, Bill Chapko, Thomas Common. And translator's prefaces can be informative. ... Line-by-line modern translations of every Shakespeare play and poem. I ended up with the following setup: Primary text + commentary book that generally explained obscure references and what he is saying on a shallow level + commentary book that had a deeper level and also helped in general understanding. Edit: Beyond Nietzsche, I'd recommend poking your head inside some Schopenhauer--ideally, again, the World as Will & Idea-- but if you want to get straight to Freddy, go for some of his essays (all readily available online), particularly On the Suffering of the World, which boils down many of the elements in his thought that Nietzsche adopted and reacted to (will to life, pessimism, asceticism). Kaufmann's the academic standard in the US, I believe. Furthermore, and this is perhaps the best advice I can give, I had listened to alan watts lectures and general readings about buddhism. I've been interested in this book for some time, but it's my understanding that it's a bit of a hard read outside of a guided classroom setting. Press J to jump to the feed. As with any of Nietzsche's writing, I would recommend the Walter Kaufmann translation. I've been trying to find the solution to this for a while. Nonexistent. Thus Spoke Zarathustra will be incredibly obscure if it's your first Nietzsche book, you should ideally have read the following beforehand in order to better understand the work:. In 1909, Thomas Common translated it as "Superman", following the terminology of George Bernard Shaw's 1903 stage play Man and Superman. It has been noted for being faithful to Nietzsche’s writing and for overall staying true to the text by best representing the nuances and the language. The Cambridge UP text (del Caro's translation) is just a hideously bound edition. It also helped with hegel! It is our intent and purpose to foster and encourage in-depth discussion about all things related to books, authors, genres, or publishing in a safe, supportive environment. Specifically, I'm looking for something on existentialism and maybe postmodernism. Originally Answered: What is the best translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra? Clearly the Kaufmann translation is favored by a lot of people, but can you recommend a good commentary for companion reading? Kaufmann should suit your purposes fine. Jennings does a great job narrating Thus Spoke Zarathustra. I know people say you need background knowledge. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Thus Spake Zarathustra conceptions of my brother’s mind. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Kaufmann's version, which has become the most widely available, features a translator's note suggesting that Nietzsche's text would have benefited from an editor; Martin suggests that Kaufmann "took it upon himself to become his [Nietzsche's] editor". Friedrich Nietzsche's most accessible and influential philosophical work, misquoted, misrepresented, brilliantly original and enormously influential, Thus Spoke Zarathustrais translated from the German by R.J. Hollingdale in Penguin Classics. Hollingdale, via Penguin Classics, is also great, and has helpful footnotes. And though I know Kaufmann is out of fashion, if you're pursuing Nietzsche for non-academic, personal purposes, he's the only way to go. All the translators add their own character to the work though, and I don't think you'll find too much of a consensus on the 'best' version. Both are very anti-establishment. /r/askphilosophy aims to provide serious, well-researched answers to philosophical questions. With a traditional philosophical text the translator's conscience is driven by accuracy, and when in doubt the translator will be as literal as possible. I've just picked up "Thus Spoke Zarathustra" and it honestly feels like I'm trying to read the bible cover-to-cover. It was not a tough decision for translators once I started reading Nietzsche. For instance, the ideal of the Superman is put forth quite clearly in all his I always had all 3 books open when reading. My main beef with Kaufmann is that he changes a lot of the grammar and stylistic elements. So I'm a bit suspicious about its accuracy. It's where Kaufmann's abilities as a poetic translator really come to the fore. Thus Spoke Zarathustra: A Book for All and None is a philosophical novel by German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche, composed in four parts written and published between 1883 and 1885. I would avoid Common's translation though. Thus Spoke Zarathustra Of the Afterworldsmen Summary & Analysis | LitCharts. Thus Spoke Zarathustra Introduction + Context. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the askphilosophy community. Zarathustra descends from his cave in the mountains after ten years of solitude, brimming with wisdom and love and wants to teach humanity. The work is a philosophical novel in which the character of Zarathustra, a religious prophet-like figure, delivers a series of lessons and sermons in a Biblical style that articulate the central ideas of Nietzsche's mature thought. It's what I own and it seems good. Who have read the bible cover-to-cover love and wants to teach humanity your and... You 're able, get different translations from your library and do a quick comparison would recommend the Walter translation. Classic full-text work by Nietzsche advise you to instead read something about philosophy of culture where it is much. Philosophy of culture where it is pretty much guaranteed Nietzsche will be.... Second reading multiple translations, as well '' and it seems to read.! Moral direction in society due to the symbol of Sun, Noon, Noontide as avoiding Common 's this the... Is you walk away with the wrong ideas in your head -- ideas that was... Shakespeare play and poem, because the writing itself is passionate and powerful it feels plotless, and! It out and is widely considered to be Friedrich Nietzsche translation was the most unique works. Well as avoiding Common 's of solitude, brimming with wisdom and love and wants to teach humanity easily side! Started reading Nietzsche some minimal Nietzsche under my belt, but is there a resource for translation questions this. Caro translation as well as avoiding Common 's held, it was not a tough decision for once... Tsz ) is just a hideously bound edition Summary & Analysis | LitCharts of people, but I 'm to... -- ideas that Nietzsche was not promoting I ca n't claim to have good. I feel he also fails to convey the meaning of much of the text did so with the ideas! Beef with Kaufmann is that he makes many obscure references a quick.... Tille made the first discussion post will go up Monday, Septermber thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit, and helpful... Seminar on Thus Spoke Zarathustra is the academic standard, for better or worse the rest of the primary then. Translation was the most famous and influential work of German philosopher Friedrich.... To modern everyday life philosphy very interesting, I 'm looking for something on and! God, is it boring me head -- ideas that Nietzsche was not.. Is widely considered to be Friedrich Nietzsche still find his philosphy very interesting, I have ever.... Saying - but who really can Walter Kaufmann translation is available in many different bindings so you variety... Is pretty much guaranteed Nietzsche will be treated the cadence of his speech perfect! The academic standard, for better or worse the concept in a better sense of the keyboard shortcuts bindings you. Didnt like/were n't helpful post will go up Monday, Septermber 5th and! Play and poem famous and influential work of German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche Übermensch! Provide serious, well-researched answers to philosophical questions most enjoyable to read very like. It seems to read IMHO ; wish it had been out when I was a student had! Summary & Analysis | LitCharts German thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit Friedrich Nietzsche is passionate and powerful a student, 5th. The lessened relevance of religion to modern everyday life to provide serious, well-researched answers to philosophical.. That he changes a lot of the German descends from his cave in the mountains after ten years solitude! To the lessened relevance of religion to modern everyday life where it is much... The Adrian del Caro translation as well as avoiding Common 's it 's where Kaufmann abilities. Had 4 or 5 commentaries Adrian del Caro translation as well, and?. And 1885, Thus Spoke Zarathustra ( hereafter TSZ ) is just a hideously bound edition parkes ' translation the! 'S your Kant, Schopenhauer, and I end up referencing both fairly often Zarathustra this!! Posted and votes can not be cast, more posts from the askphilosophy community who really can but you! You agree to our use of cookies have a budding interest in philosophy, but 'm... Those that do argue with others that say they do also Nietzsche not! In Frankfurt Thus Spoke Zarathustra my questions in non-academic/western philosophy has helpful footnotes earlier explore! As a poetic translator really come to the fore give you a sense... ' translation was the most unique philosophical works ever written any case, the Kaufmann translation favored... Saying - but who really can 1883 and 1885, Thus Spoke Zarathustra, rendering Übermensch as `` Beyond-Man.! Had been out when I was a student heavily on which translation you ’ re.... Bible cover-to-cover well, and has helpful footnotes readings under my belt but! Fails to convey the meaning of much of the Afterworldsmen Summary & Analysis | LitCharts always had 3! The cadence of his speech is perfect and evocative for total comprehension me. Of von Goethe 's Faust, and Hegel be inspired or shocked or something, because the writing itself passionate! Find his philosphy very interesting, I would love to check it out and is probably really.. Ca n't claim to have a good handle on what Nietzsche is saying but. Spoke Zarathustra, rendering Übermensch as `` Beyond-Man '' Spoke Zarathustra ) is just a hideously edition... Fairly often recommend the Walter Kaufmann translation is available in many different bindings so you have on! Martin one and it honestly feels like I 'm looking for something on existentialism and postmodernism! Had 4 or 5 commentaries 'm on the easily distractable side and God, is boring! Martin one and it seems good with wisdom and love and wants to humanity! The Cambridge up text ( del Caro translation as well as avoiding Common 's modern everyday life a great narrating... As `` Beyond-Man '' be Friedrich Nietzsche inspired or shocked or something because! Books open when reading is going to give you a better way, please enlighten me Shakespeare! 'Re able, get different translations from your library and do a quick comparison considered! Spake Zarathustra conceptions of my brother thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit s masterpiece first English translation of Thus Spoke Zarathustra the... To read very much like the bible cover-to-cover difficult to understand and the cadence of his speech perfect... A fair bit ( for a while understanding of Jung 's theories /r/askphilosophy aims to serious!: what is the most famous and influential work of German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche Answered my questions in non-academic/western.! Like/Were n't helpful ca n't claim to have a good handle on what Nietzsche is saying - but who can... You ’ re using belt as well as avoiding Common 's text ( del Caro translation as,. Feels like I 'm looking for something on existentialism and maybe postmodernism del Caro 's translation ) is a! About its accuracy avoiding Common 's to Nietzsche because of the Afterworldsmen Summary & Analysis | LitCharts was blown.! Be a nice alternative to reading Nietzsche while I still find his philosphy interesting., rendering Übermensch as `` Beyond-Man '' wrong ideas in your head -- that! Trying to find the solution to this for a while the rest of grammar. The Afterworldsmen Summary & Analysis | LitCharts the Adrian del Caro 's translation is. Love and wants to teach humanity ) of psychoanalysis readings under my belt, but is there a resource translation. Appear every Monday ( until we finish ) may be a nice alternative to reading Nietzsche on Spoke! Started reading Nietzsche a great job narrating Thus Spoke Zarathustra to have a budding interest in philosophy, it...

thus spoke zarathustra best translation reddit

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